Dear Christian Bible College Professor,
I just read an article you wrote and I wanted to respond to it. I have much respect for you and I have been reading your articles since I was a college student. However, in this article, I’m bothered and feel compelled to comment. I hope that I have missed the point that you are trying to make with this article, and if that’s the case, please delete this comment and write it off as, “Bitter - Party of One.”
http://www.johndhowell.com
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2 comments:
Mr Howell you mention that we do not need anymore young people “pastorized” in the local church. My question is this: what is your view of the local church? It seems that underneath your comment is the underlying assumption that the church is irrelevant, disconnected from culture, and does not offer services that the culture around us needs. This statement in particular disturbed me: “Instead of having them create a church planting proposal - why not have them create a plan that might have an impact on culture today? Why not have them create a plan that works towards social change instead of creating a plan that is just going to add to the millions of voices clamoring for attention in today's society?” It seems that you are insinuating that the church does nothing to bring about social change in our contemporary culture. If this is so, this is sad indeed. However, seeing as the church planting plans were service oriented churches it sounds that the next generation greatly desires to reach out to the surrounding community and seeks to impact culture and society. You are also insinuating that the church has no impact on the culture around us.
You then make this statement: - “would those men and women from 1780 be content with a well-written plan to start a church? I don’t think so. I think they’d be out starting organizations that work towards solving society’s most pressing problems.” My question is this why would the people start organizations to deal with societies most pressing problems when they could simply work within the organization of the established church? What you are proposing is that instead of having the students write a proposal for a church they should right a proposal for an organization outside of the church such as a para-church organization. So you yourself advocate starting organizations rather than actually doing something. Perhaps you would have these students write up a business plan for a non-profit organization.
Finally you say, “My hope for the next generation and the generations to come is that they will be more interested in being the hands and feet of the body of Christ instead of just being the mouth. We've got enough mouth's around - what the church needs is people who are willing to step in and actually do some work, myself included.” I think that is precisely what the next generation desires and seeks to do hence there focus on service oriented churches.
My question is this; why your bitterness towards the church?
You seem to have a weak ecclesiology as well. Why the desire to distance yourself from the church? I truly believe that the church is hope of salvation in a lost and dying world. As Cyprian said, “They cannot call God their Father who have not the church for their mother.”
Interesting comment, anonymous. I don’t normally respond to anonymous posts, but I find your comments intriguing. So - here goes.
what is your view of the local church?
My view of the local church. Maybe you’re asking about my local church. Well, my local church is phenomenal. We are impacting people on a daily basis in ways that other churches are not able to. We have lost people entering into a relationship with Christ with each week. We are a growing church that is focused on being intentional for Christ in our every day lives. And yes, my local church is a Wesleyan church so I guess if you’re looking to find fault, find fault with the Wesleyans - they made us this way.
However, I don’t believe that you are asking me about my local church experience but rather my actual view of the local church. With that said - I think the local church is far too comfortable with itself. I see very little risks taken within the church leadership. I see a tragic number of people in the pews who are content with the way things are. I see boards and committees who are so wrapped up in the business of doing church that they sometimes forget what they are really working towards. In short, I see the local church as all to often being in their own world without any understanding of the bigger world at hand.
It seems that you are insinuating that the church does nothing to bring about social change in our contemporary culture. If this is so, this is sad indeed. However, seeing as the church planting plans were service oriented churches it sounds that the next generation greatly desires to reach out to the surrounding community and seeks to impact culture and society. You are also insinuating that the church has no impact on the culture around us.
Hmm - I guess I am stating that the church does nothing to bring about social change in our contemporary culture. Maybe I should say that the church does very little to bring about social change in our contemporary culture. I agree with you that this is very sad. And I don’t think that church has much if any impact on the culture surrounding the majority of the world. We sort of live in Church World where everybody want to know about God. I don’t think that’s anything like the real world that most people live in.
You see here’s the thing, my generation, GenX, has pretty much stalled out. With the exception of a few hundred thousand of us who are really doing some tremendous things, for the most part - GenXers have been pretty much very self involved and content to let the Boomers and the Silents lead the way. We grumble a lot - but most of us aren’t going to ever do anything about it. We have no passion and that’s very sad.
But you’re right. The next generation (the Millennials/Gen Y/Gen We) greatly desires to reach out to the surrounding community and seeks to impact culture and society. They are the most socially conscious / technologically advanced / environmentally friendly generation yet. They are world changers and they have tremendous potential! They don’t understand what the GenXers, Boomers, or Silents have done - they are the new Heros on the block and will change the way we do church! Think of this generation as the new GI Generation - only instead of going to war with other countries - they are going to go to war with everything they see that is wrong with the world.
My question is this why would the people start organizations to deal with societies most pressing problems when they could simply work within the organization of the established church?
Who says that these organizations can’t work within the organization of the established church? I certainly didn’t. In fact, I would say that if this next generation can learn to use the resources that are currently available in the established church, the impact they will make will be incalculable. I would even go so far as to say that these new organizations must stay within the established church if for nothing else but accountability.
What you are proposing is that instead of having the students write a proposal for a church they should right a proposal for an organization outside of the church such as a para-church organization. So you yourself advocate starting organizations rather than actually doing something. Perhaps you would have these students write up a business plan for a non-profit organization.
Keith stated that he had the students write out a church planting proposal for his class. I’m simply saying that rather then a church planting proposal - why not a social change proposal? How is writing a business plan for a non-profit organization that brings people to a practical knowledge and understanding of God’s love a bad thing? On the other side of things - isn’t a church planting proposal really just a business plan for a non-profit organization? that’s how the secular world would look at it.
As far as the comment you make about advocating starting organizations rather then actually doing something. I’m at a loss for what you’re using your word trickery skills for in this instance. I don’t think I ever stated that but since you make that comment you must have felt that I thought that - so let me clear that up for you. It’s very simple - If you don’t have a plan, you plan to fail. Write it down, pray about it, and get to it. If you can fulfill the dream that God has placed in your heart without having to start a new organization great - if you can’t, then start it up and start working towards it. That it. Nothing more, nothing less. For myself personally, I’m more interested in going to where God wants me then I am in staying in the comfort of what I know.
I think that is precisely what the next generation desires and seeks to do hence there focus on service oriented churches.
Good - then I think we are on the same page when it comes to thinking about the next generation. So maybe the problem is that this next generation just doesn’t understand that God works outside of the the established church? Maybe by exposing them to other concepts and ideas, this next generation will stumble upon something that will spark a new reformation in the church! I would guess my question to you would be - why does it have to be within the structure of the church?
My question is this; why your bitterness towards the church?
I don’t think I’m bitter with the church. I do not want to distance myself from the church in any way. I love the church - I just think you and I are talking about two different things. See, I’m of the impression that the church is the people. What matters most is this, Love God, Love people. Love the people, cherish the people, pray for the people, care for the people, and teach the people. That’s what I think the church really is and should be about. I’m not so sure that the majority of churches get that.
You see, I loved being a pastor - both a youth pastor and a senior pastor. If I didn’t love it I would never have gone through the ordination process and accepted the responsibility of ordainment. It was an honor for me to serve in that capacity each opportunity that I was given to lead and teach. I’m thankful that God provided me with that opportunity and used it to prepare me for the opportunities I had as a counselor. I’m thankful that God provided me with the opportunity to counsel the teens and young adults with wisdom and discernment. I’m grateful for all the opportunities that God has placed in my path, is providing for me now, and is preparing for me in the future - so I don’t think that makes me bitter.
However, I do wish that the church was different. I wish that the people cared more about planting a garden to give food away then about building a new parking lot. I wish the people cared more about hearing the Word of God spoken and taught then they do about where they’re going to eat afterwards or who’s playing who in the NFL this Sunday. I wish that the people would be more concerned about whether their friends and neighbors have a relationship with God then with what they think about them. I wish that the people of God were more interested in having a dialogue with God then a monologue. So - if that makes me bitter then I guess I’m bitter.
You seem to have a weak ecclesiology as well. Why the desire to distance yourself from the church? I truly believe that the church is hope of salvation in a lost and dying world. As Cyprian said, “They cannot call God their Father who have not the church for their mother.”
Weak ecclesiology? A quote from Cyprian? Personal attacks? Either you are a college/seminary student or you’re a pastor who probably needs to put his books down and go spend some time with some real, non-Christian people. I’d try getting a part-time job at the big-box store in your area or your local supermarket - I’m quite confident you’ll find some non-Christian people there that you need to get to know.
Thanks for your comments, it was sort of interesting sparring with you. One last thing - next time put your big boy pants on and sign your name - be accountable for your words otherwise what good are they?
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